Outboard resurgence.

Tuscany
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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Tuscany » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:42 am

jhnmdahl wrote:If in salt with a sterndrive, definitely OceanX outdrive or similar, and no raw water cooling! Replacing the heat exchanger in a closed-loop cooling system is a pain, but not as much as a new engine.
Like I said, having a lot of time to weigh options is a great thing.
The downside is that having a lot of time to weigh options greatly complicates the decision. But my personality is to break everything down and research until my head hurts. It's hurting right now. :D
My particular issue is that I never thought I would be buying a new boat, so new technology and options are all new to me. I haven't boat shopped in 15 years, so there is a lot of catch up to do.
I made the mistake of checking out an R5, and then really messed up by showing it to my wife. She is the boat lover in my family.

If I were to build my dream, it would be an R7 with a 350 or bigger Merc outboard.
I'm pretty convinced an outboard is the way to go in all cases today, and especially true if there is a possibility of mixed fresh salt use.
So, it's either a 25SC, or an R7 as it sits going into the boat show in Toronto.


Question, is there a way to properly flush the heat exchanger on a cobalt equipped with a 380 VP?
Thanks.

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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by jhnmdahl » Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:13 pm

Yep, hook a hose up to the hose fitting and let the engine idle once the hose is running, and the fresh water from the hose will flush out the salt water when moored. Of course you're still sitting in salt water, but that's hard to avoid...
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Skiingstrongman
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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Skiingstrongman » Fri Dec 30, 2016 1:36 pm

Get an R7 with a merc 380 big block with the sea core and close water cooled. Can't go wrong there.

Tuscany
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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Tuscany » Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:46 pm

No big block for me.
IMO, I think a BB will adversely affect resale in 5 years.
I could be wrong, but I doubt you will see a big block available in the near future when the same power rating, yet more efficient fuel consumption can be had, along with 270lbs of weight savings by going with the 380VP. And the VP comes with closed cooling.
Merc has to be working on something different to update that power segment. And I wouldn't be shocked if it's concentrating on outboards.

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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by jhnmdahl » Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:19 pm

Considering decades-old technologies like variable valve timing have just started becoming common in sterndrives the last couple years, I think there's probably still some room for gains in both inboard and outboard efficiency. I did a similar analysis and went with a Volvo short block a few years ago (albeit in a 210), and am generally pleased that I did.
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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Skiingstrongman » Sat Dec 31, 2016 3:46 pm

I have first hand experience with both. I have a 230 and my father has a 226. I have the 300hp merc small block and my father has the VP 7.4 300HP that was discontinued in 2000. The main difference is he can maintain speed no matter what his load is. The engine is all torque. He has about 5 mph more top end than me but the 226 is known to be a very fast hull but the biggest difference I notice is with a full load. It doesn't seem to make a difference for him whereas I lose about 4 mph with a full boat. That being said he uses a lot more gas at cruising speeds.

An example would be when I am slalom skiing my small block has a little trouble pulling me up (I'm a pretty heavy skier) but I've never had difficulty coming up on the big block.

I think it just depends on what your main use is. As John said time will tell if the smaller engine is far superior another 5 years will leave the big block obselete. My next boat will have a 380 no matter what.

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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Big Block Power » Sat Dec 31, 2016 4:50 pm

I also have had both engines. In the future yes what they are coming up with will be better all around. But I don't think I use anymore gas from stop and go to cruising. If anything I think it's better. It didn't matter at all who or what was in the boat it just pulled. Full throttle different story. But no boats are good at full throttle. I will say the Volvo gxi series is better than the mag series from merc. And I'm a merc guy. I was highly disappointed in my 350 mag in my Cobalt 200 with a b3. I think props have allot to do with that also. I think Volvo did a better job with that also. But my 350 mag in my crownline was a rocket but it had a alpha drive and a great prop. Still now having a bbgxi it would be tough to give it up.
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Tuscany
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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Tuscany » Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:07 pm

Guys, the VP 380 that I'm using for a comparison to the BB just came out a couple years ago, so unless you owned a new boat from 2014 or newer, you never owned it.
It's not the old 350, or 5.7L or random GM small block.
It's a 6.0L used in the GM 2500HD trucks.
Quicker, faster, more torque, faster response, much better fuel mileage and almost 300 lbs lighter.

http://www.volvopenta.com/volvopenta/na ... 380-C.aspx

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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Skiingstrongman » Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:27 pm

Tuscany wrote:Guys, the VP 380 that I'm using for a comparison to the BB just came out a couple years ago, so unless you owned a new boat from 2014 or newer, you never owned it.
It's not the old 350, or 5.7L or random GM small block.
It's a 6.0L used in the GM 2500HD trucks.
Quicker, faster, more torque, faster response, much better fuel mileage and almost 300 lbs lighter.

http://www.volvopenta.com/volvopenta/na ... 380-C.aspx

I absolutely realize this. Please don't be mistaken I am not trying to encourage nor discourage your decision. I'm simply trying to offer experienced unbiased results. I am not committed to merc or VP. I travel on a pretty small lake compared to the mid west guys so gas mileage is not much of a factor for me. I do a fair bit of toy towing so that's my primary deciding factor. Truth be told if I won the lotto tomorrow I would own a Formula FX5 with dual merc 430s. I live closer to the sound than the lake but I don't want to ski/wakeboard on the sound and I couldn't be bothered trying to convince my girlfriend to go in the ocean.

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Re: Outboard resurgence.

Post by Tuscany » Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:42 pm

No problem. If I go with a stern drive, my mind was made up months ago.
As far as experience, have you owned or driven the new VP 380 yet?
Thanks.

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